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I am going to attempt to see through the redness of rage and try to write this article in a manner which may accurately reflect the facts and try my best to keep the four-letter words to a minimum. This may be the most important article I have ever posted, so I hope any and all fans of the beaches of North Carolina will listen up and listen well.
As of today, February 20th, Derb Carter (919-967-1450) at attorney for the Southern Environmental Law Center (to be referred to as SELC), on behalf of the Defenders of Wildlife ( Referred to henceforth as DoW, Contact Person: Jason Rylander: 202-772-3245) and the National Audubon Society (Henceforth referred to as NAS, Contact Person: Chris Canfield: 919-929-3899) filed an injunction in federal court to suspend beach driving on portions of the Cape Hatteras National Seashore, in areas that “that have been identified as being most critical to threatened and endangered shorebirds in order to protect them before the upcoming breeding season begins.”
What does this mean?
I’ll give the short version. The DoW and NPS have been trying for years to shut down access to the beaches of North Carolina to ORV users. (For clarification, ORV means Off Road Vehicle and refers to any vehicle capable of driving in the sand; trucks, cars, dunebuggies, 4 wheelers, motorcycles, whatever.) Their primary claim in recent years has been to tout the “national seashore” as a protected location for the Piping Plover, and a few other shore birds. Basically, they want to ruin the entire economic infrastructure of the east coast of north carolina for a few birds which aren’t even native to the area.
First and foremost, those of you who love birds need to understand something that apparently the DoW and the NPS fail to realize, no matter how many times it gets brought up. There is NO SUCH THING as the Cape Hatteras National Seashore. Let me explain…
Originating August 17, 1937 (see reference 3 at the bottom of this article for details) a large part of the seashore of North Carolina was marked off by congress for the specific use of “public recreation.” On January 12, 1953 it was actually established and put into existence. I will translate public recreation into “people being able to enjoy themselves” for the sake assuming that was the general intent. Furthermore, the area is not, wasn’t ever, and has never been a “State Park.” The fact that the state-owned land is managed by the “National Park Service” and the simple abbreviation of “Cape Hatteras National Seashore Recreational Area” into “Cape Hatteras National Seashore” seem to have confused people into believing that this is actually “Cape Hatteras National Park,” or maybe Cape Hatteras Piping Plover Park, or some other such nonsense. The area in question is comprised of 30,319.43 acres, or 122.7 square miles, of seashore. Basically the US government got together at the behest of many citizens and agreed that we east coasters of North Carolina could have 0.22% of our great State of North Carolina for public recreation. Yes, that’s right, you read it right 1 fifth of 1 percent of our state is reserved as the Cape Hatteras National Seashore Recreational Area. (For those who like obtuse facts, the land in question occupies .0000003237% of the land mass of the United States. Yeah, less than 1/3 of one millionth of one percent)
Why again are they fighting to get this injunction? To preserve endangered shore birds and species of flora, such as the Piping Plover, the Seabeach Amaranth, the Colonial Waterbird, and the American Oystercatcher, among other species.
I’m going to detail some of these right away, and save others for further discussion.
The American Oystercatcher:
(taken from the NAS’ Own web site!)
American Oystercatcher can be found breeding in the U.S. along the Atlantic coast from Massachusetts south to Georgia, and in selected localities along the Gulf Coast in Florida, Alabama, Louisiana, and Texas. In recent years the number of records of the species north of Massachusetts has increased with several breeding records from Maine. American Oystercatcher is also a permanent resident of marine coastlines throughout the Caribbean and Central and South America. The northernmost breeding populations, from Massachusetts to Virginia, are migratory, and appear to spend the winter in the southeastern United States. Birds found along the southern Atlantic Coast and the Gulf Coast seem to be permanent residents. A number of Audubon Important Bird Areas (IBAs) provide critical nesting, migratory, and wintering habitat for American Oystercatchers. These IBAs include North Carolina’s Cape Hatteras National Seashore IBA which supports 30 nesting pairs; Georgia’s Altamaha River Delta IBA, which supports up to 250 oystercatchers during migration/winter; Florida’s Big Bend Ecosystem IBA, within which 400-600 wintering birds can be found at Cedar Keys National Wildlife Refuge (NWR) and perhaps hundreds more at Lower Suwanee NWR (585 birds were seen here in November 2000); and Florida’s Hillsborough Bay IBA, which hosts an average of 66 breeding pairs of American Oystercatcher. Blah Blah Blag…
Let’s make sure we all understand this.
1) the Bird is NOT endangered.
2) It apparently flourishes in 9 eastern contiguous states, plus florida
3) It flourished in two other countries AND another continent.
4) HUNDREDS of them are seen elsewhere breeding just fine with no help from us.
5) CHNSRA seems to have the LEAST of them anywhere…
So, that tells me that they aren’t suited as well to our climate but survive everywhere else just fine. How about we let mother nature handle this bird as she seems to already be doing a fine job of it already?
Seabeach Amaranth:
This one is easy.
1) They are native to beaches, but NOT to ours.
2) The only ones we have ever had were artificially transplanted there by us, not nature.
3) Those died…
Hmm.. seems like that wasn’t meant to be either.
The Piping Plover: I am SOOO sick of hearing about this bird.
(Facts excerpted from the US Fish and Wildlife Service)
- Piping plovers were common along the Atlantic coast during much of the 19th century, but commercial hunting for feathers to decorate hats nearly wiped them out. Following passage of the Migratory Bird Treaty Act in 1918, plovers recovered to a 20th century peak in the 1940s. Increased development and beach recreation after World War II caused the population decline that led to Endangered Species Act protection in 1986. Intensive protection has helped the population more than double in the last 20 years, but the most recent surveys place the Atlantic population at fewer than 2,000 pairs.
- Atlantic coast piping plovers breed on coastal beaches from Newfoundland and southeastern Quebec to North Carolina
- Storm tides, predators or intruding humans sometimes disrupt nests before the eggs hatch. When this happens, the plovers often lay another clutch of eggs. Chicks hatched from these late-nesting efforts may not fly until late August.
- Piping plovers often gather in groups on undisturbed beaches before their southward migration. By mid-September, both adult and young plovers have departed for their wintering areas. These birds winter on the Atlantic coast from North Carolina south to Florida, along the Gulf coast, and in the Bahamas and West Indies
Let’s analyze how reducing ORV Access will save these birds from what man has done to them…
- We don’t hunt them for feathers, so don’t blame that on us please! Get real!
- They PEAKED in the 1940s? Wow.. they’ve been declining for 60 years but it’s all the fault of four-wheel drives?
- They apparently breed in THOUSANDS of miles of coastal beaches AND in Canada, but you want to close MY beach? Why?
So, you want to stop us from driving on the beach because of a bird that has been suffering from darwinian decline for 68 years? How is that exactly going to affect the Muskrats, Foxes, Wolves, crows, deer, and pedestrian traffic that causes damage to these birds?
IMPACT OF THIS INJUNCTION
I’d like to start with a few simple though processes, in the hopes that someone from the Audubon bothers to read this. First, we don’t drive ON the dunes. It’s illegal and you can’t easily do it anyway even if it WERE legal. Secondly, we locals aggressively watch out for the endangered species that are marked out on the beaches. Just because we like to drive on the beach doesn’t mean we don’t enjoy nature too. Third: 90% of beach driving is done at the tide line. Absolutely NONE is done intra-dune; you can’t get between the dunes and if you DID try it, some locals would make much worse of you than any law would. You do NOT destroy OUR beaches! Lastly, we are almost all driving on the sand near the tide. So, let’s assume we weren’t there to disturb this pretty little bird. What would happen?
A) It would drown.. there are WAVES where we are driving. It’s called a tide, happens twice a day. Ring any bells?
B) It would get eaten by crabs.
C) It would get eaten by muskrats, foxes, hungry midgets, etc.
Ok.. let’s forget the rights of the people to use the park for what it was intended for. Let’s just analyze the economic impact of this on the beaches coastal communities. Absolutely ALL of these communities comprising the Outer Banks need the tourists for survival. Hundreds of thousands of tourists travel across the entire United States to be able to drive on our beaches, fish from our shores, and spend money in our restaurants, gas stations, hotels, and stores. The economic damage this injunction would cause is incalculable. You’re talking about a locale where the population changes from 20,000 in the Winter Season to over 3 Million visitors in the summer. Drastic fluctuations in the housing economy, which is mostly built on the rental property design, would plummet property values in less than year. Restaurants that operate seasonally would lose valuable customers, followed by staff, resulting in the closing of their doors forever. Sport and commercial fishing would suffer horrendous damage to their economies as well.
Listen up people! WE LIVE HERE! This is OUR beach and the United States Congress says it belongs to US, not to the birds, the amaranths, or to anyone else. What happens if a bird species dies off? Nothing. The world goes on. It’s a scientific fact that more species disappear from earth each day than have ever been discovered in the history of exploration. Do you really think ruining our incomes, our past-times, and our economy are worth saving a few dozen birds?
You’re truly out of your mind! Go play your animal politics in a REAL state park and you’ll have my endorsement, my support, and even my money! But keep your filthy trifling hands off my families income and my family’s beaches! Until congress decides these beaches ARE a wildlife preserve, you have no right to be here any more than anyone else. So shut up and enjoy the sun like we do!
This needs to be fought and fought now!
If you’d like to lend your voice or support to the cause, I have made a forum on the NCBBA web site, where I am the site moderator, where we members and visitors alike are discussing the injunction. You can visit the NCBBA forum here:
http://ncbba.powweb.com/buggyboard//viewforum.php?f=7
Reference Materials For This Article:
1) SELC Injunction Information, copied in its entirety for reference, but available for personal viewing at : http://www.southernenvironment.org/newsroom/2008/02-20_hatteras_prelimin.htm
QUOTE
Federal judge asked to restrict driving in order to save 2008 breeding season on Cape Hatteras National Seashore
- Derb Carter
- SELC Attorney 919-967-1450
Representing:
- Defenders of Wildlife – Jason Rylander, 202-772-3245
National Audubon Society – Chris Canfield, 919-929-3899
Raleigh– Conservationists are asking a federal judge to suspend beach driving on portions of the Cape Hatteras National Seashore that have been identified as being most critical to threatened and endangered shorebirds in order to protect them before the upcoming breeding season begins. The Southern Environmental Law Center, representing Defenders of Wildlife and the National Audubon Society, filed for a preliminary injunction in U.S. District Court requesting that beach driving be halted along approximately 12 percent of the shoreline to allow birds to nest and raise chicks. The requested closures were recommended by the Park Service’s own scientists and are vital to a successful breeding season in 2008.
“At this point, every breeding season is critically important to the shorebirds that nest on Hatteras. Fortunately, by limiting driving on even this small area would help protect them during this season, giving the Park Service time to develop and implement a reasonable long-term plan to manage driving on the beach,” said SELC attorney Derb Carter. “Each year we see fewer and fewer of these species on Hatteras. Waiting any longer for the Park Service to properly manage beach driving could very well mean we have nothing left to protect.”
The organizations seek to restrict driving along those portions of the Seashore identified by scientists for the Park Service as being the most critical to nesting shorebirds. The proposed region represents approximately 12 percent of the available shoreline (see map). Importantly, the areas would still be open to pedestrian access, allowing Park visitors to continue using these areas.
The National Park Service, which is charged with developing and implementing a plan to manage beach driving to protect and preserve the region’s natural resources, is currently undertaking a process to develop future rules for driving at Hatteras. However, NPS admits the process will take at least three years to complete. Scientists agree that several species could be eliminated from the Seashore in that time.
“Waiting three more years for National Park Service to figure this out is simply not an option. We can’t risk repeating the unfortunate events of last year by losing even more of Cape Hatteras’ wildlife,” said Defenders of Wildlife staff attorney Jason Rylander. “The Park Service’s actions are not only negligent, but also illegal.”
Cape Hatteras National Seashore is home to nesting shorebirds, such as the threatened piping plover, the common tern, and the American oystercatcher. The number of colonial waterbirds nesting on Seashore beaches declined from a high of 1,508 nests in 1997 to 212 nests in 2007 - an 86 percent decline in 10 years. Last year, two of the imperiled shorebird species, gull-billed terns and black skimmers, disappeared entirely from the Seashore. Since 1995, common terns have been all but eliminated at the Seashore while American Oystercatchers have seen their numbers decline by almost one half since 1999.
Cape Hatteras National Seashore is currently operating under an interim management plan that doesn’t adequately protect the area’s wildlife and consistently favors ORV access over protection for threatened and endangered species. In fact, according to materials provided by the Park Service at recent public hearings, less than one percent of Cape Hatteras National Seashore is permanently closed to vehicular use for the protection of natural resources. Under the Park Service’s interim management plan, this year is expected to be another extremely poor one for nesting birds.
“The only way to safeguard everyone’s access to Cape Hatteras is to put a responsible, science-based vehicle management plan in place now. That the Park Service has failed to do so imperils not only the birds and natural areas, but also the safety of all visitors,” said Chris Canfield, executive director of Audubon North Carolina.
The Park Service has failed to develop a permanent beach driving management plan for decades despite being legally required to do so. In addition to federal regulation requiring such protection, in 1973, President Nixon ordered all federal agencies, including the National Park Service, to regulate beach driving to protect natural resources. Most recently, U.S. District Court Judge Terrence Boyle issued an order concluding that driving on the Seashore is illegal as the Park Service has failed to adopt beach driving regulations.
END QUOTE
2) Island Free Press Article, February 19, 2008, copied in its entirety for reference, but available for personal viewing at: http://www.islandfreepress.org/2008Archives/02.19.2008-EnviromentalGroupSeeksInjunction.html
QUOTE
Environmental groups will seek injunction to stop beach driving
Breaking News
By IRENE NOLAN
- The environmental groups that have sued the National Park Service over its interim protected species plan at Cape Hatteras National Seashore will ask a federal court judge on Wednesday, Feb. 20, for a temporary injunction to stop beach driving until the lawsuit is settled.
Environmental group seek injunction to stop beach driving
The environmental groups that have sued the National Park Service over its interim protected species plan at Cape Hatteras National Seashore will ask a federal court judge on Wednesday, Feb. 20, for a temporary injunction to stop beach driving until the lawsuit is settled.
Members of a negotiated rulemaking committee that is working on a long-range plan to regulate ORV use on the seashore got the news Tuesday afternoon in an e-mail from Patrick Field of the Consensus Building Institute, one of the facilitators working with a committee to negotiate a long-range ORV plan.
“The plaintiffs in the lawsuit over the interim plan and those members of the Committee let us know this afternoon, Tuesday, that they plan to file a request for a preliminary injunction with the District Court tomorrow, Wednesday, February 20th.
“Once the document is filed with the court, they will provide a copy of that (request for a) preliminary injunction to us to forward to the Committee.”
The Defenders of Wildlife and the National Audubon Society, represented by the Southern Environmental Law Center (SELC), filed a lawsuit against the National Park Service on Oct. 18 in federal district court in Elizabeth City over its failure to adopt regulations to manage beach driving at the Cape Hatteras National Seashore.
The suit claims that the interim protected species management plan under which the Park Service has been operating does not do enough to protect species of shorebirds and sea turtles that nest on the seashore.
The groups also filed a 60-day notice of intent to sue over violations of the Endangered Species Act in connection with the interim management plan.
The lawsuit contends that the interim plan, which is intended to protect the birds and turtles until a long-range plan is adopted, does not go far enough.
The National Park Service is currently involved in two concurrent processes to formulate a long-range plan for ORV use on the seashore beaches.
They are:
- An ORV Management Plan and Environmental Impact Statement (EIS). The Plan/EIS will guide the management of ORV use at Cape Hatteras for the next 10 to 15 years and is required by the National Environmental Policy Act. The first public scoping meetings were last year, and now the National Park Service has developed a list of preliminary options for ORV management. The Park Service hosted a series of public information meetings in January to answer questions about the options and will accepted public comment on the alternative options until Feb. 15.
- A negotiated rulemaking advisory committee had its first meetings on Jan. 3 and 4 at the Avon Fire Hall. This committee is appointed under federal law by the Secretary of the Interior to assist the Park Service in developing rules for operating ORVs on the seashore. The next meeting of the committee will be Feb. 26 and 27 in Kill Devil Hills.
You can find more information on the negotiated rulemaking committee and other efforts to develop an ORV plan in the Shooting the Breeze column at the top of the front page of this Web site.
Other relevant links on the Free Press site are:
http://islandfreepress.org/Archives/2007.11.05-ShootingTheBreezePlanningFutureOfBeachDriving.html
and
- http://islandfreepress.org/Archives/2007.09.05-BeachDrivingCrisisAndHowWeGotHere.html
- The Island Free Press will continue to post updates on the plan by the environmental groups to seek an injunction.
END QUOTE
3) Title 16 of the U.S. Code, Chapter 1, Subchapter LXIII, Section 459 (Designating the area for recreation, not preservation)
Copied in its entirety, but available at: http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+16USC459
QUOTE
From the U.S. Code Online via GPO Access [wais.access.gpo.gov] [Laws in effect as of January 3, 2005] [Document not affected by Public Laws enacted between January 3, 2005 and June 19, 2006] [CITE: 16USC459] TITLE 16–CONSERVATION CHAPTER 1–NATIONAL PARKS, MILITARY PARKS, MONUMENTS, AND SEASHORES SUBCHAPTER LXIII–NATIONAL SEASHORE RECREATIONAL AREAS Sec. 459. Cape Hatteras National Seashore Recreational Area; conditional establishment; acquisition of lands When title to all the lands, except those within the limits of established villages, within boundaries to be designated by the Secretary of the Interior within the area of approximately one hundred square miles on the islands of Chicamacomico, Ocracoke, Bodie, Roanoke, and Collington, and the waters and the lands beneath the waters adjacent thereto shall have been vested in the United States, said area shall be, and is, established, dedicated, and set apart as a national seashore recreational area for the benefit and enjoyment of the people and shall be known as the Cape Hatteras National Seashore Recreational Area: Provided, That the United States shall not purchase by appropriation of public moneys any lands within the aforesaid area, but such lands shall be secured by the United States only by public or private donation.
(Aug. 17, 1937, ch. 687, Sec. 1, 50 Stat. 669; June 29, 1940, ch. 459, Sec. 1, 54 Stat. 702.)
Change of Name
Words “national seashore recreational area” substituted in text for “national seashore” pursuant to act June 29, 1940.
END QUOTE
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Tags: 29 Comments
29 responses so far ↓
Well said, even though those reddend eyes. I can imagine some of the thing you really wanted to say because I too have been saying them. As a property ower and long time visitor of the Outer Banks, this is the stupidest attempt to control us ever. I have asked the questions and none of the organizations DOW,NAS etc can or will answer. If quite undistrubed beaches are required for these winged critter to cohabitate, why aren’t the poping at the seams over on Portsmith Island??? Maybe because, as you stated, and is posted at the visitors center at the lighthouse. The stupid little PLOVER in at it’s very edge of it’s breeding grounds. They breed in Long Island.. the ones in Hatteras are just too lazy to fly the rest of the way to their nesting places…
Tommy, you have put into succinct words what brings my emotions out when I try to do what you have done. Thank you. It is not easy to lay the facts out with all the small twists and turns that this issue is going through. In the last few years, there have been NO HUMAN causes that a plover egg, unfledged chick, or fledged chick died. None. Ghost crab, other birds, mammals, and God created weather & tide events did them in. The park Service under direction of Mike Murray have gotten better results doing the best job they can splitting the fine hair of undisturbed bird nesting/ ORV fishermen. They should be commended for this job well done. Yes, there are problems, but to us fishermen, and property owners on the Outer Banks, they are small. Again thank you.
Jim Harris
I have owned a beach front cottage on Buxton Beach for 5 years, 200 yards north of the Jetties.
This is an investment in my retirement. And of necessity it is a rental property for the time being as I would not be able to afford the mortgage without that income. My rental season and income is dependent on the access to fishing at Cape Point National Seashore and Recreational Area and the ORV access to the best fishing on the east coast, and the best beach for family fun. My family’s retirement is dependent on this continued access. Another concern is what happens to the beach in front of my cottage if ORV access is stopped? The streets of our neighborhood will be clogged with illegally parked cars of fishermen and families using the ramp over the dune (which I built for some $6,000 of private funds) and making our our narrow, eroded beach much, much less attractive to renters. Crowded conditions and delicate dunes stressed by overflow. And the shore birds now there all day will have to relocate, their environment no longer hospitable.
Even though the fishing is good on Buxton Beach, I am a fan of the Bull Drum and Cobia available at Cape Point, not this far up the beach.
Much of my own recreational fun will be gone, and I’ve invested several hundred thousand dollars in that. All for the sake of 12 Piping Plover chicks fledged in the last 10 years. Common sense needs to prevail here.
How about establishing a Sportsmans Piping Plover Chick Hatching Fund which will develop the artificial conditions necessary to hatch, grow and release Piping Plover and other protected shore birds, like what is done with pheasant, quail and chickens. Soon there would be thousands more in the flock. It would be easy to spend much less money and get better results than what will be spent to get 12 in 10 years. Consider that seriously, please.
Dude,you are one right on mother……!Great site and it must be great to have it to post facts AND speak YOUR mind!!!
Excellent post. We are amazingly short sighted. It is incredible how slapping a federal name on something like the National Seashore makes it Federal. Is Federal Express the post office now?
I completely agree ruining an already weak economy is paramounrt to destroying our economy.
Just stumbled on this site while looking for info on what I needed to be able to drive my 4×4 on the beach near Oregon Inlet campground this summer. My family and I found the primitive campground last year and loved the idea of camping so close to the beach, and were absolutely excited about the idea of buying a truck and a 5th wheel, coming back this year and camping at that beautiful site and spending time driving on the beach and exploring new areas. We bought a Silverado and are looking at 5th wheels now. To think that beach access to ORVs may be limited, especially under the pretense of saving these birds is ridiculous. We spent some time on the northern beaches of Pea Island last year as well, where there seems to be more restrictions on beach activities, and were amazed at how few people were there. I am not a native of the area, and could not afford any properties on the island, but I think it would be catastrophic to lose what appeared to be quite a draw to Bodie Island - that is ORV activity on the beach. I hope Derb Carter, Jason and Chris as well, come to their senses and realize what an impact this injuction could have on your area. In real terms - economic. I am soooooo sick of sacrificing human rights in for the sake of animal rights. God created animals for our use, not the other way around. Besides, as you clearly stated and I have witnessed from only one season on the beaches of Bodie Island, it is a stretch of the imagination to even imply that ORV traffic on the beaches has any impact at all on the activities of the “native” and “endangered” species. Thanks for providing us all with the facts and fighting for us!
My family is so sick about you trying to close our beaches over a handful of piping plovers.I used to support defenders of wildlife, but you have taken this too far and for what? I think the people of Dare co. should sue your asses for good.This is the bread+ butter of most of the people who live here.So go bother someone else’s beach.I will never defend your group. Defenders of wildlife. Shame on you
[…] see which side wins out. For a more in depth story about this I invite you to check out Tommy’s blog entry on Carolina Region. Cape Hatteras National Seashore, carolinaregion.com, National Park Service, off road vehicle […]
This matter is so very important to more people thaneven THEY realize. A lot of people don’t respond because they think it will never happen. You need to get letters/articles in The Richmond Times Dispatch and/or surrounding local papers to let visitors know just how serious this situation is.
thanx,jill m.
Nice job. {Black Bear Blog brought me to this site.} I know it’s difficult now, but, keep it up. Your words are not falling on deaf ears.
Bravo! My god someone who is thinking with there mind and not wearing their heart on their selve!
[…] Injunction To Stop Beach Driving, ORV Access, and ruin the Outer …To preserve endangered shore birds and species of flora, such as the Piping Plover, the Seabeach Amaranth, the Colonial Waterbird, and the American Oystercatcher, among other species. I’m going to detail some of these right away, …[Me-Tom-orphasis] - Welcome - http://carolinaregion.com […]
You know what screw them birds. to many.If they stop us from driving on the beach its going to kill that place.if you cant drive on the beach to park were the heck are you going to.Ive seen some parking places but you could fit like 4 trucks. they need to open the beaches for good!!!!
I am definitely left of center when it comes to supporting wildlife but these guys have taken it too far. Completely shutting down access isn’t necessary. I’ve read their “scientific” studies - they’re completed twisted to support their conclusions…AHHH!
Right on, brother! I have a Hummer, and I’m looking forward to tackling those dunes! They’re not as hard as you say; just give her a little more gas, and I’m sure that the sheer weight of this badboy and the power of the engine will prevail. Screw the friggin’ birds.
Obama is a terrorist.
McCain ‘08!!!
I hope everyone is having fun aggreeing with each other. So much for a free exchange of ideas. There are plenty of extremeists on both sides of this issue. Somewhere in the middle you wil find a solution. But not long as the extremes kep their feet nailed to the floor. I have read al the facts of this case after winding through all the rhetoric and double talk (including on this site) and here are a few things to remember.
1. Drving is a right and not a privilege. This includes driving on the beach.
2. Federally endangered means federally endangered even if you have beach nesting birds in Iowa. (which they do by the way.)
Everyone should just calm down. The birds will be gone and you’ll have plenty of access in time for the really good fishing in the fall. Quite crying. You can catch all the spot, croaker and seamullet a mile down the beach.
Have fun filling that hummer with gas!
Ed,
You’re a complete idiot!
1) The legal definition of Right and Priveledge are the same thing, depending on your source of legal reference. While I agree with your concept, it’s actually not correct.
The “priveledge” to drive is granted by the government, and can be revoked by the government.
The “right” to enjoy the beach WE PAY FOR and which is NOT a federal wildlife preserve is something you obviously have no capability to understand.
Your comment that “The birds will be gone and you’ll have plenty of access in time for the really good fishing in the fall. Quite crying. You can catch all the spot, croaker and seamullet a mile down the beach” is absolutely ridiculous for multiple reasons.
1) We aren’t “crying” because we can’t fish for spot or seamullet (you traditionally do that from a boat, not from the surf and you usually use the inland water for croaker since they aren’t a salt water fish… )
2) The ability for us to catch croaker has no impact on the hundreds of millions of dollars we are losing from our tourist economy. Do a little more research.
3) I dont drive a hummer. The guy that said that is just making things worse for all of us who are trying to save our economy.
4) I love your source for claiming knowledge on the topic. “I have read al the facts of this case after winding through all the rhetoric and double talk”…. apparently not.. I actually named all my sources and reference material.. all we have is your word that you know what the hell is going on. You don’t even know the habitat of croaker, so pardon me if I’m not keen on taking your word for it.
Excuse me if I am not willing to take your word for it regarding the “hundreds of millions of dollars” The tourist economy is losing. Please show me that it is caused by ORV restrictions and I’ll vote for Ron Paul. Its the Economy! Your rant is well referenced but I was mostly responding to your posters. Yes you are crying and no I am not an idiot. You can catch croakers in the Ocean and Least Terns will nest inland. Look it up!
Well, I made this post to garnish feedback and that’s what it’s done, so I’ll agree to disagree on the point. Neither of us has the time to debate it endlessly, so what’s the point.
I DO appreciate that you took the time to leave your input on the matter… and I DO agree that some of the poster’s comments sometimes make us look worse than others, but I don’t want to get into the habit of deleting comments unless they’re completely vulgar, so I leave them here in an effort to give others the same rights of free speech that I have when making the post myself.
My apologies for calling you an idiot. It was uncalled for and I was in a… “mood” for lack of a better word. As far as croaker, well agree to disagree. lol.
The Atlantic croaker, sometimes called drum, golden croaker, or hardhead, inhabits Atlantic coastal waters from Massachusetts to Florida and into the Gulf of Mexico around Texas. From March to October, croaker will be found over sandy or grassy shallows of the Chesapeake Bay and move into deeper water in the winter. The bulk of the catch from the Mid-Atlantic is usually taken in July, August, and September.
Maybe we’re both right in a sense. I know I’ve caught some nice Croakers in the Ocean. I’m not done looking for holes in your logic.
lol. Fair enough, but since it’s my site I win the coin toss for protagonist… you have to be the antagonist.
2) The ability for us to catch croaker has no impact on the hundreds of millions of dollars we are losing from our tourist economy. Do a little more research.
I am still waiting for some of your research on how ORV prohibitions are costing your tourist economy “hundreds of millions of dollars”.
I’d also like to hear if anything has changed. Nesting season is winding down and the plovers and terns should be moving along soon.
Tommy, I hope you don’t mind me jumping in here, but I think I can provide you with some of the data. I am a small business owner on the Outer Banks. My spring business was down over 30%. While the economy is down everything, my reps tell me that other stores like mine were only down 10-15% in the spring. I am in KDH, but the business down south, in Hatteras and Ocracoke were down by as much as 60%. Our summer orders were placed in October and January, so this wasn’t even in the courts then, or we would have ordered much less than what we did. Fortunately, our distributors are allowing us to make payments, but this has caused a major financial hardship on them as well. They are inland corporations and they have laid off half of their labor force as a direct result of what is happening here. (The Outer Banks region is responsible for a large percentage of tackle sales). We have not hired a staff for this summer. Last summer we had a full time and a part time employee. The lay-offs are greater on Hatteras Island.
Now Ed, you are right that the birds will be leaving soon, but then we will experience a full beach closure starting September 15th for any turtle nests that are approaching their 50 day hatch window. No big deal you say? Well we have approximately 99 nests located on park grounds. Depending on where these nests are located and when their hatch date is, it can become just as much of a nightmare as the bird closures were.
The only time we will experience “free and open beaches” will be from November until March, if we are lucky. If the stripers stay away like they have been doing, then we will have no reason to fish then. What happened to keeping a promise? This land was given over to the government on the condition that locals AND visitors would have access.
As for croakers and other fish being anywhere in the ocean, that is simply not true. Fish are fish, whether they live in the ocean or in a lake. They still congregate around structure and holes and areas where the bait is. Inlets meet those requirements. Why do you think the birds go there? There is 13 miles of beach left pristine for wildlife-it is called Pea Island. There are also many man made spoil islands in the sound that are covered with the birds in question. Funny how the environmental groups refuse to put these islands in there data? Why? Then they wouldn’t have case in court!
Thank you
Carol,
Thanks for taking the time to post. I’m quite sure it carries more authority coming from someone right there in the thick of it. I appreciate you taking the time to share the realities of the burden here on the site.
Those of us that care are trying everything we can to inform our legislators and get others to do so as well, so we can get this repealed in the courts.
Ed, I hope you read these words… from a local business owner.. who is suffering at the cost of a few birds… when does small business make it to the Endangered Species list?
Thanks Carol,
I feel for you. As someone who ran a seasonal restaurant for many years I know what it feels like to have a small window to make a living. Its the reason I sold my restaurant 4 years ago. I know that here, the tourism data is coming back 40-50% down from last year. Its bad everywhere. If the price if gas is an issue, of course driving the extra miles to Hatteras Island is not an option for some people. Lets not blame the birds or the turtles.
Thanks for posting everyone. Stay involved and continue to standup for your rights. I know that your livelihoods are on the line, but understand that there is going to be a tipping point where not everyone is going to be allowed to drive on the beach. The development that has gone on along Hatteras Island isn’t sustainable. Don’t forget to put that in your calculations!
Actually Ed, most of Hatteras Island is National Park. There are a few small towns where development has occurred, but nothing like what I have seen in many other beach communities. You obviously missed the part in my post where my sales reps and vendors are telling me that what is occurring here is not occurring on such a grand scale AT ANY OTHER LOCATION. Part of it absolutely is the economy, however that is a very small part of what we lost. I purchased things based on the Point being open. When the Point is open in the spring, I sell at least one or two heaver rods a week. I have sold two this year, with one of those rods being used on the pier. I am sitting on my high end rods which cost me over $200 a piece. I can’t give them away at this point.
IF the data these groups were using were accurate, there would be less opposition. As a former teacher, I can tell you, that scientific data is only reputable if it has been replicated and then validated by a jury of peers. This has NOT happened. These groups are using the latest European movement in environmental studies. It is called the “precautionary principal.” Loosely, the movement means that you use the strictest measures possible BEFORE any scientific data can be gathered or corroberated just in case their might be harm to an animal. If I followed the same principal to govern my life, I would never get out of bed or eat for fear. These groups also want voluntary population control with a maximum of 2 children spaced out about 4-6 years per family. Sorry-this sounds like a way to control the poor areas. Remember Hitler started with voluntary measures for the Jews.
Forgive me if I seem a little bitter, but I grew up believing that in America, you could achieve your dreams with hard work, perserverance, and little bit of luck. I did not realize that the lobbyists in DC had gained so much control that our country is no longer “by the people, for the people, or about the people.”
And no-I do not blame the birds or the turtles, THEY did not sue the Park Service, lawyers who want to continue to make money off of my taxes did.
And one more piece of data-in the early 90s when the economy was also sluggish, our area actually fared better because we are a “one tank stop” for a huge population group. We traditionally do well because people who would normally go to places farther away, come here because it is closer and cheaper. In addition, our diehard fishermen would come regardless of the price. The may not be able to come as often, but they would come. They are not coming because they cannot fish where the fish are. Again, let them use accurate data. The truth would be a refreshing change from all of the spin. I am amazed they can still walk straight.
Didn’t know this was a forum on population control or anti-semitism. As I said in my first post, there are extremes on both sides and I think you diatribe about your american dream takes away from an otherwise well framed argument. NCBBA and OBPA could have sued the Park Service but they didn’t. Status Quo was fine. I hope you are all paying attention now and have your own attorneys filing briefs for what you believe are your rights. In the end America is still a land under the rule of law and it works. It isn’t perfect, but democracy can be a messy business.
Just as a point of reference, NCBBA can’t lobby. Their non-profit structure prohibits it. They CAN sue, but not loby, which makes it very hard for them. NCBBA members can do anything they want as long as they don’t do it on behalf of the organization (such as me creating this post to generate awareness.)
OBPA can lobby, and are doing so vigorously on the internet, via mail, and on television. However they can’t do it all by themselves.
(Butting out now)